Suggestion: I'd personally like every course we manage to fund here to be shared on the site OCC.

[Whitetiger]

Hello,
As I said in my previous message, personally, I'd be in favor of all the courses we manage to fund here being able to be shared for free on OCC (as has always been the case, up until now, when someone wanted to share a particular course. I've funded several courses out of my own pocket that I've then shared on OCC for free and I don't think that should change for group buys).

Especially since it divides the community in two:

• those who can pay and have access to a "premium" type of courses
• those who can't afford it and will only be able to access OCC courses (without premium usage)

As a result, we're losing the very essence of the site, which was to provide content for all those who don't have the money. While technically, most of the courses we're trying to fund come from COLOSO, CLASS101, it seems logical to me that these should also be available to everyone, (as was the case when someone shared them on their own).

It's just my suggestion, though, and I'd understand if some people didn't agree. But let's not forget why OCC was created in the first place: to help, not for profit. And it makes me very sad if that changes, because it's currently one of the few sites (and even the only one) that offers this system.

 

[chen3080067]

we are considering creating a GBC membership program, but the details have not been fully developed yet

I think it is necessary to bind the GBC account with the mediafile Premium account. I paid a one-year premium membership fee for OCC's mediafile Premium account last year (opened on September 1, 2022, and expired on September 1, 2023). But now the focus of OCC courses has shifted to GBC, which makes it difficult for users who have opened mediafile Premium members to continue to pay to help OCC continue to develop. Please think carefully, buying mediafile Premium account users for OCC is really supporting your early development.

 

[owl]

Hello everyone,

I want to clarify the distinction between GBC and OCC. OCC offers more than 10000 paid courses for free, and we've successfully become the second most popular site for this purpose. GBC, on the other hand, is for those who want to improve skills through specialized paid courses after they've already studied.

OCC provides many great courses for free covering various subjects, helping people become professionals without any cost. GBC is focused on more high-quality content that is not leaked for some reason. Some have suggested putting GBC courses on OCC for free. However, we need to consider how GBC buyers would feel about their paid courses being free on OCC. This could diminish the value of their investment.

We're open to sharing GBC content on OCC, but we're thinking about offering it to premium OCC users with a delay of 2-3 months. This way, we can balance the interests of both GBC buyers and OCC users while keeping the quality of our offerings intact.

Thank you for your understanding.

 

[xiexieuiui]

any course that i fund and download, i will freely offer it to anybody else who wants to have it. the concept of "ownership" of digital content is fucking wack, considering it's being pirated to begin with.

if you don't want to share among the community, just pay $700 per course from your own pocket and don't share it.

 

[elon]

I completely agree with Xiexieuiui!
Personally, I've bought and shared a lot of stuff and I'm sure that most people who have contributed will be truly disappointed if the courses here get "privatised".
Plenty of people have agreed with whitetigers message about sharing the courses

, others on OCC and telegram.

Admins can we please get a final decision?
We-re debating almost every week about sharing or not sharing the courses that have been funded here .

I really need to know if they are going to be shared.
Mind you, I have principales even though I "share" content. For me it's important that the community keeps existing and that people who don't have the income can access to educational tutorials necessary to realize their dreams.

And even though I really want to own most of the courses here (waiting for paypal) , I won't spend a dime if it's not shared and will buy them from their original website even though I hate not being able to download them.

I've recently stopped sharing books in another community, for the same reason and shared most of my japanese drawing books on Z-lib. Yep, most drawing books on z-lib come from yours truly and a chinese website . I've stopped buying books, unless I'm really interested and when it happens I keep them now for myself. Because I don't need more than what I already own and this group was no more a community but buyers and resellers.

I apologize for my rant.

 

[Whitetiger]

I also totally agree with Xiexieuiui & Whitetaker.

You should at least give members the opportunity to vote at each group buy, to see who agrees to share content for free on OCC, as this choice should be left to the members. The final decision rests with the members who help finance the courses.

Although I have to admit that reading your message Owl really saddened me, as I've personally shared a lot of courses on OCC (which cost the same as here), I just feel betrayed. In my opinion, there's no reason why you shouldn't share OCC courses free of charge. GBC was supposed to offer new opportunities to the community, not ultimately be a platform that privileged those who could afford it.

If you do that, I'm afraid it will split the community in two and create what I mentioned earlier: frustration, hostility, resentment, and nothing good can come of it.

 

[owl]

Well, let me emphasize the same about sharing courses. If you're considering sharing a course, it's best to purchase it at its regular price. When you're part of a GB, you gain course access along with all other participants in that GB.

About a year ago, something simillar occurred that our long-time members might remember. We obtained access to (TT) courses and organized a GB with a much lower price than usual. Unfortunately, shortly after sharring the course, it was leaked for free on CGPeers. This led to complaints from the course owner and caused difficulties for Strawberry.

It's crucial to realize that our platform, already open to everyone, involves substantial risks. This helps explain the careful progress of PP. We need to make sure our platform remains efficient by preventing disruptions and complaints.

I understand that many of you feel it's unjust to essentially purchase knowlegde, and I'm in complete agreement with you. That's why we've had the Course for Premium option in place for quite some time. ☭ It's about fairness – contributing as per your ability and receiving as per your needs☭.

A similar principle will apply to GBC. If you're interested in a course, you can simply contribute positively to the community. Initiate GBs, assist new users, share resources – believe me, we'll take notice and show our appreciation.

Access to group buys is not just about money. Right now, Strawberry is providing free premium access to everyone, all to kickstart the project and attract active and engaged users to this platform. Creating a forum where the main focus is on USERS contributing – that's the goal. Group buys are just one way to organize communities to access resources. Within this platform, we aim to build a complete community. This community will include books, assets, references, and more. The OCC team has been sharing with everyone, without exception, for over 5 years. That's 5 years of effort from two individuals, putting in 4-8 hours a day, every day, without brakes or weekends. The result is a user community where almost everyone has something to share.

In conclusion, sharring courses in our community requires a balanced approach that respects everyone's efforts and aligns with our goals. Your understanding and cooperation are truly appreciated as we navigate these challenges together. We're also in the process of learning and striving to offer the maximum benefits. Take a look at OCC. Strawberry has created its own file-sharing platform, transcoding and compressing every lesson in every course posted on occ and enabling a seamless online watching experience of every lesson without the need for downloads. They're even working on subtitles and translation and are currently exploring AI Text-to-Speech technology. The outcome? What OCC accomplishes is unparalled worldwide. And it's all done single-handedly. Strawberry functions as the admin, developer, and support, while Redcat lends a hand with posting articles. We aspire to acheive the same here, at GBC – providing a wealth of features and involving users to the fullest extent. The aim is to make being a part of this community a privilege, a club membership. Our intention isn't to create a basic course shop. There are plenty of groups on Telegram focused on reselling, but we aspire to be more than that. We aim to stand apart from the simple resell model prevalent in many places, which lacks innovation and merely functions as a market. Here at GBC, our ambition is grander – to foster a thriving community. It's the sense of community that truely matters to us.

 

[elonmusk0346]

Certainly, I understand your concerns about sharing recently purchased courses on the website, especially considering the issues Strawberry experienced in the past. It seems wise (unfortunately) to avoid sharing them on the Online Course Community (OCC) if they could potentially cause problems again.

However, I'd like to suggest a possible solution. For individuals who might have financial constraints and find it difficult to pay for these courses, perhaps we could consider reducing the prices for them. This way, more members could have the opportunity to participate and benefit from the courses. This approach could help us strike a balance between avoiding potential issues and still making our courses accessible to those who might be financially limited.

 

[Whitetiger]

The day you launched GBC and promoted it on OCC, the aim was to enable the community to acquire specific, high-quality courses and thus open up new opportunities (at least, that's what it said). At that time, it wasn't a question of having a course resale site (like any other resale site), but rather a possibility of obtaining courses of a certain quality, thanks to the community's contribution, and potentially help everyone access it later. More like a fundraising site. At least, that's what I understood from the message on OCC.

Now, the message you're sending us is this : « GBC is any kind of resale site », which contributes absolutely nothing to the community, but just to a solo individual who can afford to pay (and has the courage to get into crypto or pay the premium subscription fees). So in the end, it's not a site that brings together people to fund such and such a course and to create mutual support, it's a resale site, nothing more, nothing less.

Not to mention the many inconsistencies and shadows in all this. Between the fact that you've obtained almost triple the price of a course and that you still want people who arrive late to pay twice the price of the course (when the price of the course has been reached 3 times and has already been paid for ?), on the other hand the financial contribution of each participant doesn't decrease (when the minimum number per participant has been reached and there are even more people) and so on. It's all just complicated and lacking in logic.

What's even more disappointing is that you haven't taken the opinions into account at all in this suggestion, even though a large number of members have agreed to share the courses (in exchange for waiting a minimum of 3 months).

Once again, I fully understand that you devote an enormous amount of your time to bringing these platforms to life, and I'm grateful for that. I'm all for you earning money, that's perfectly normal (whether it's to pay for servers, yourself, the other tools you need, like artificial intelligence etc). But the lack of transparency and given that you've clearly just ruled that courses won't be available on OCC for free clearly show the original intentions of this forum.. It wasn't to contribute to the community at all.

 

[arimakana]

I understand the course owner being aftraid of being "caught" by sharing the courses. This is understandable.

But at the same time, what is apparently happening here, is course reselling. The organizer getting more than the price course's cost and we don't know where that money is going to.

The lack of transparency and the clear change of priorities here is simply giving a bad feeling.

I was ready to get into crypto stuff (something i never did) just to help with some GBs thinking it would actually be for the community. But now it's clearly not the case.

It's still incomprehensible to me how people sharing courses at full price is fine while someone paying way less for it (and even profiting with it) isn't.
What is the logic behind this?

"I paid 1/10 of the price of this course and I won't accept anyone who hasn't paid at least the same amount to have access to it!"

And I've seen way more people arguing in favor of making the courses available than I've seen people being against it. So what's exactly going on here?

And just to be clear: I understand the effort that is put into OCC and I appreciate it. Having donations, premium system, etc is something I'm definitely favorable to and I'm happy to support as long as things can still be shared with those who can't afford it.

But what is happening here is going into shady territory already.

 

[strawberry]

...GBC is any kind of resale site..

with all my respect, this statement is absolutely controversial to what Owl has mentioned in his post(s), neglecting and devaluating all the following conclusions in your post

 

[arimakana]

(...) Within this platform, we aim to build a complete community. This community will include books, assets, references, and more. (...)

(...) In conclusion, sharring courses in our community requires a balanced approach that respects everyone's efforts and aligns with our goals. (...)

I appreciate this idea and I support it.

But this and that are different matters.

Having an engaging community can be done by offering the means to do so (which you guys are doing).
The GB itself is a different matter altogether, tho.

Someone can (and probably lots of them will) simply join the GB, buy the course and not engage in anything else. Their goal is to have the course. Period.
Same for someone who downloaded something for free on OCC.

On the other side, you will get people engaging in discussions and sharing materials, content, etc even without participating in the GBs, because that's a different kind of interest altogether.
A forum to discuss art, share knowledge and everything is a thing of its own.

GB is people giving their money for a product. They are buying something for a cheaper price. And the thing keeps being sold even after the price of that thing + whatever else has been covered.

You can't really mix those 2 concepts together and try to say one justify the other, because those are apples and oranges.

I don't think anyone here is against the idea of GBC as the one you described. At all.

What people are trying to discuss is a single aspect of it (which is the one that this platform is named after). People want the group buys to have clearer rules and their intent being obvious from the beginning. What is happening here is people buying something and feeling like they paid for something believing it would be A and now it's C.

 

[aspiring_artist]

Hello everyone,

I want to clarify the distinction between GBC and OCC. OCC offers more than 10000 paid courses for free, and we've successfully become the second most popular site for this purpose. GBC, on the other hand, is for those who want to improve skills through specialized paid courses after they've already studied.

OCC provides many great courses for free covering various subjects, helping people become professionals without any cost. GBC is focused on more high-quality content that is not leaked for some reason. Some have suggested putting GBC courses on OCC for free. However, we need to consider how GBC buyers would feel about their paid courses being free on OCC. This could diminish the value of their investment.

We're open to sharing GBC content on OCC, but we're thinking about offering it to premium OCC users with a delay of 2-3 months. This way, we can balance the interests of both GBC buyers and OCC users while keeping the quality of our offerings intact.

Thank you for your understanding.

Ouch that wasn't expected. It feel kinda weird , like I am just a few seconds from crying. Sorry but as a person who doesn't even own a credit card and being dependent on my parents for even my meals it feels as if I'm not much worth anything and this was like a nail to the coffin. Sorry I don't mean to offend anyone its just that I can't hold my emotions back

 

[Whitetiger]

with all my respect, this statement is absolutely controversial to what Owl has mentioned in his post(s), neglecting and devaluating all the following conclusions in your post

My goal is absolutely not to devalue anyone or create controversy, I'm just giving my impression, and I have this feeling (no disrespect intended). I'm just honestly terribly disappointed by this announcement, it even makes me sad...

How is GBC different from other resale sites, given the announcement that has been made? I can't understand how it's different now, since it uses the same mechanisms (i.e. pay for your courses or you'll get nothing! And if you want to pay less, well, wait 3 months, but hey still pays a bit). There have been plenty of group buys sites like this, which ended badly.

What made GBC unique was precisely its usefulness to the community, to contribute to all and also the hard work you put into this platform. Of course, when I say community, I mean OCC too, because after all, they're linked in one way or another since you're attracting a certain OCC audience to GBC.

It's just unsatisfactory to see that none of the proposals here have been studied. Suggestions aren't taken into account. Without mentioning there's an obvious lack of clarity (especially on the points I mentioned earlier).

I am in no way trying to belittle, minimise your work or disrespect you or Owl. I have no interest in doing so. On the contrary, I'm trying to understand why you made this choice and to get answers to these inconsistencies.

There is no justification whatsever for asking a member to pay TWICE the price of a course that has been largely financed (and even funded three times). Nor does it make sense to make these courses available only to premium users, when quite a few people have indicated here that they are willing to share the course for free after 3-5 months, because they are grateful to OCC. What's more, you get the courses with a huge discount? Why shouldn't we share on OCC when some nice people are cashing in on a single course and don't hesitate for a second to share with everyone? I mean, it makes 0 sense..

 

[elon]

I think we can all agree that transparency is a big problem and may or may not have caused misunderstandings in this GBC community.
Many on OCC, GBC and telegram wish for GBC's success. We want it to work out like OCC, being able to share content for anyone.
Some of us are incredibly passionate about the subject and are speaking out expressing discontent because they care and want things to change. These members are great assets in this community and have expressed plenty of times their wish to fund multiple courses.

The aim is not to offend someone but convey worries that multiple members have voiced since the creation of this group.

 

[arimakana]

(...) What's more, you get the courses with a huge discount? Why shouldn't we share on OCC when some nice people are cashing in on a single course and don't hesitate for a second to share with everyone? I mean, it makes 0 sense..

Another thing is that the person who is organizing the GB gets way more than the amount of the course (and possible other costs too for downloading, translation, sub/dubbing and proofchecking and other possible editing) covered and then what? We keep giving them profit?

Initially I thought things would be like this:

Fundraising for a course -> Course is bought - > Course is distributed -> Keeps being sold for X months for the double fee price -> The extra amount gathered would be used to fund other courses - > Courses become available in OCC after X months for everyone.

Let's remember people are willing to pay to get something faster.

Edit: the way i mentioned in this post would make it so more popular courses would help funding the less popular ones.

 

[klora]

Another thing is that the person who is organizing the GB gets way more than the amount of the course (and possible other costs too for downloading, translation, sub/dubbing and proofchecking and other possible editing) covered and then what? We keep giving them profit?

Initially I thought things would be like this:

Fundraising for a course -> Course is bought - > Course is distributed -> Keeps being sold for X months for the double fee price -> The extra amount gathered would be used to fund other courses - > Courses become available in OCC after X months for everyone.

Let's remember people are willing to pay to get something faster.

Edit: the way i mentioned in this post would make it so more popular courses would help funding the less popular ones.

This ^^^^^^^^^^^

Also individuals could potentially vote on using the excess credits we've funded to purchase another course. It's important to note that you already receive a 10% cut per transaction.

 

[arimakana]

This ^^^^^^^^^^^

Also individuals could potentially vote on using the excess credits we've funded to purchase another course. It's important to note that you already receive a 10% cut per transaction.

Yes. Exactly.

And it can either be everyone agreeing with an already existing GB that is in need of funds or suggest a new GB to apply the excess.

This way the money will always be used for courses and increasing the library of courses for everyone. And the ones who pay for it can get access to it way earlier and faster than those who will get it from OCC.


I don't think this place should become a place for people to find a way to get profit and increase their income. This would sooner or later corrupt the whole core of OCC and this community (which is important to note was born from OCC and what it stands for).

Edit: And let's not forget that the only person who should be getting profit from the courses is the creator of the course. This is still piracy.

 

[Vhexen]

Lol this discussion is pretty heated, in the best way possible i mean, since people shares and improve on each others ideas to get the best outcomes

So let me contribute a bit here, personally i download a handful of courses on the site, all thanks to the nice people whose willing to share the courses they bought with their own hard-earned money, with that in mind, I Personally think it would be selfish and hypocritical of me if I didn't contribute back to the community with the course I owned, that's why I've already shared most of my courses In the OCC website,

Now This statement Is my personal opinion and It's my own Personal decision to share the course I owned because I bought with my own money

For Group Buy whoever Since the courses is bought collectively by a group of people, They themselves should have the right to collectively decide whether or not they should share the course or delay the released on OCC through discussion and polling, after they done with their decision then tag the page as "Completed" and list the Verdict of the group's decision on why they would or would not share it. If they refuse to share tho, someone could starts another group buy with the same course and called "stage 2" or something, and Do note the group buy page has to fit the price of the actual course

As for how this site gets it's money to stay up, Offer some services like it already did (AI Sub, Proofread, File compressions, AI dub, etc) adding Subscription based model to the site to access all successful group buy course could invalidate the people who contributed, since why would they pay for group buy if they can access everything to subscription where the money doesn't go the course maker.

That's probably the most fair and logical solution I could think of on this matter, Please tell me what do you guys think about it.


TLDR: If people buy a full course as an Individual they should have the rights to whether or not share it with the community, But if people buys it Collectively as a group then the decision making should be made as a group through discussion and polling, etc. The site host could charge for an extra Services for everyone at a considerable price to get Extra cash to stay afloat, like they already did now.

 

[elonmusk0346]

Admins, it's getting too long. Many of us are now thinking to not Invest our money In the courses anymore. Below Is the sum-up of questions everyone been asking. Please provide a detailed answer:

1. Courses for OCC Community: Will the courses ever be available for the OCC community? Some folks who have already purchased them are thinking of sharing them without waiting, but it'd be so much better if you could officially give them to the community. This way, we'd be happier and more willing to support financially.
   
   (If you give away these courses for free and It result in fewer people investing in GBC. Then you can stop sharing)
   
   
2. Where's PayPal?: The community Is wondering that why they can't use PayPal yet. It would be great if you could let us know if there's a problem or something. Without an explanation, we're guessing you might be ignoring us, which makes us upset. Many of them only have PayPal, and some groups haven't been paid even though they have the right number of people. Those groups won't make enough money if PayPal isn't an option. That's not fair to those of us who paid early In hope to get the course ASAP, but now have to wait weeks.
   
   
3. Money Questions: Some of us are confused about why some groups got more money than they needed. We'd like to know where that extra money is going. We want our money to help courses that were left behind. If you're planning to use the money for AI stuff, why do we have to pay 10% extra? Shouldn't that extra bit be for the AI? If it's not enough, it would help if you could show us where the money is going.

It would mean a lot if you could answer these questions. Being open with us makes the community better. We want to understand why things are happening and trust that you're doing the right thing. Thanks for listening.

 

[elonmusk0346]

After careful consideration, I have decided to withdraw my participation from all groups, with the exception of the two for which I have already made a payment.

My intention is to step away from these groups temporarily, and I plan to rejoin once a final decision has been reached regarding the matter we discussed. I believe that the possibility of sharing within our community could greatly benefit everyone involved. Therefore, I kindly request that we revisit this decision in due course.

If, however, the decision remains unfavorable towards sharing within the community, I feel compelled to inform you that my associates and I have discussed the option of providing our group-buys to the community without charge. We hold the community's best interests at heart and want to ensure that everyone can benefit from the resources available.

Thank you for your understanding and consideration. I eagerly await your response and hope for a positive resolution that aligns with the spirit of collaboration and mutual benefit.